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    Sam Allardyce chooses to ignore criticism of his team’s playing style

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    Jiggs
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    Sam Allardyce chooses to ignore criticism of his team’s playing style

    Post  Jiggs on Sat 26 Apr 2014, 2:27 pm

    Hammers manager Sam Allardyce chooses to ignore criticism of his team’s playing style
    West Ham fans may have something different to say, but Hammers boss Sam Allardyce insists there is no reason for his team to change their style next season.

    Supporters booed them team off despite a victory over Hull City in March and were at it again following Saturday’s loss to Crystal Palace, but the manager is not perturbed by it.
    “You can only change with the team you get,” he insisted. “Style is just a label that everybody uses against me no matter what style I play. “I am never going to get rid of that because the style I play is not what they say, just as it wasn’t at Bolton. But when the tag is laid down that is it, you can’t get rid of it so you just ignore it,” he said.

    Recent performances have been criticised for being one-dimensional, simply lumping it up to Andy Carroll, but Allardyce is paying no heed to that. “I play football to win and I use the team in the right way to win as many football matches as we can,” said Allardyce. “We try to entertain, particularly at home, by attacking and winning.
    “Everybody knows that if you see a good performance then it is relatively okay if you don’t win, but if they don’t see a good performance and you don’t win then everybody expresses their disapproval.”
    West Ham fans have certainly been doing that, both at Upton Park and on various social media sites, but it seems the manager is not for changing.

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    Ignorant, arrogant, plain stupid or all three?


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    Re: Sam Allardyce chooses to ignore criticism of his team’s playing style

    Post  Tony P on Sat 26 Apr 2014, 2:51 pm

    He is definitely arrogant and full of himself for sure. What galls me is the claim that lumping the ball from back to front to AC is "trying to entertain and play attacking football". Not in my book it isn't Sam
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    Re: Sam Allardyce chooses to ignore criticism of his team’s playing style

    Post  Admin on Sat 26 Apr 2014, 5:07 pm

    I think now seriously , he needs to collect his P45 at the gates and piss awf . He done what he was brought here to do and he has done it . Needs a new manager to have a clear out , we have played better without Fat Sams dynamic duo of Carrol/Nolan so they could be 1 and 2 to follow their master .
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    Re: Sam Allardyce chooses to ignore criticism of his team’s playing style

    Post  Campo on Sat 26 Apr 2014, 5:10 pm

    Time for him to depart, today was the last straw, remove two wide players and push 2 up front for what?
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    Re: Sam Allardyce chooses to ignore criticism of his team’s playing style

    Post  westhamonkey on Sat 26 Apr 2014, 5:12 pm

    whether you like it or not, he also has a point.

    today's game was a case in point. We were terrible... appalling, lackluster and now in really serious danger of relegation...

    but...

    for 70 minutes or so - or whenever Joe Cole came on - we played down the wings and attempted to put crosses into the box. That's actually not hit and hope or the boring long ball game that BFSA gets criticized for.

    we switched to the boring, pointless and ineffective long ball game in the last 20 minutes when we took off both wingers and put on that footballing saviour, Carlton Cole.

    Whether we play it around with the flair and confidence of Barcelona or Real Mardid - even I wouldn't argue... but - and this is the dangerous part - it's not the hit 'n' hope that everyone claims it is... not until (like today) the game is lost and we're pretty much just chasing ghosts.

    By continuing this argument against BFSA no one wins.

    Sam just retreats into his shell because the criticism is invalid.

    Slagging him for playing long ball football is pointless.

    Slag him for the stuff that's justified... losing to a team like WBA, giving their manager his first win, giving them only their 4th clean sheet of the season, taking off the wingers against a team that you can't beat by going down the middle...


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    Re: Sam Allardyce chooses to ignore criticism of his team’s playing style

    Post  Charlie Ham on Sat 26 Apr 2014, 5:14 pm

    Very arrogant and just full of all the excuses under the sun.
    Our luck could run out soon and we cannot complain if we go down.
    Others teams below us are picking up points which we are incapable of doing.
    On the tele next week so the whole country can see us lose at home to Spurs.
    Something I'm really looking forward too.
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    Re: Sam Allardyce chooses to ignore criticism of his team’s playing style

    Post  SemiOldIron on Sat 26 Apr 2014, 5:34 pm

    If we end up losing the last six games of the season, which looks likely, I just don't see how he can keep his job whether we stay up or not. How can the club sell season tickets on the promise of more of the same?
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    Re: Sam Allardyce chooses to ignore criticism of his team’s playing style

    Post  RichB on Sat 26 Apr 2014, 5:44 pm

    Allardyce set out his stall when he joined the club. He told the fans they were deluded talking about playing “the West Ham way”. “Where’s that got you?” he retorted, “not won anything and several relegations” he remarked. Well, if you’re going to come in with a gung-ho attitude like that you’ve got to do something impressive and he’s not. He still seems to genuinely believe the old Samuele Allardicci joke that if he was Italian he’d be managing Man United. Well let him go and try I say, it’s time for change.
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    Re: Sam Allardyce chooses to ignore criticism of his team’s playing style

    Post  Jiggs on Sat 26 Apr 2014, 6:03 pm

    SemiOldIron wrote:If we end up losing the last six games of the season, which looks likely, I just don't see how he can keep his job whether we stay up or not. How can the club sell season tickets on the promise of more of the same?
    The club are trying to sell season tickets with a bit of blackmail thrown in SOI ... They're absolutely shameless ......


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    Re: Sam Allardyce chooses to ignore criticism of his team’s playing style

    Post  Campo on Sat 26 Apr 2014, 6:22 pm

    westhamonkey wrote:whether you like it or not, he also has a point.

    today's game was a case in point. We were terrible... appalling, lackluster and now in really serious danger of relegation...

    but...

    for 70 minutes or so - or whenever Joe Cole came on - we played down the wings and attempted to put crosses into the box. That's actually not hit and hope or the boring long ball game that BFSA gets criticized for.

    we switched to the boring, pointless and ineffective long ball game in the last 20 minutes when we took off both wingers and put on that footballing saviour, Carlton Cole.

    Whether we play it around with the flair and confidence of Barcelona or Real Mardid - even I wouldn't argue... but - and this is the dangerous part - it's not the hit 'n' hope that everyone claims it is... not until  (like today) the game is lost and we're pretty much just chasing ghosts.

    By continuing this argument against BFSA no one wins.

    Sam just retreats into his shell because the criticism is invalid.

    Slagging him for playing long ball football is pointless.

    Slag him for the stuff that's justified... losing to a team  like WBA, giving their manager his first win, giving them only their 4th clean sheet of the season, taking off the wingers against a team that you can't beat by going down the middle...



    fair points, this is the way i see it

    He has had 5 transfer windows and been backed to a certain degree by the owners with cash, 3 big signings included
    This is now his squad with his players , playing utter dross one way and one way only, it is not working
    had we played the 'sam' way and been on 50 points then fair play , but we are shit on 37 points just, and are looking at 2 wins in the last 11 games of the season
    the players look demotivated and as pissed off as the fans are, there is something wrong in that dressing room,
    the squad we have is not that bad on paper

    He has got to go before next season or we are down
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    Re: Sam Allardyce chooses to ignore criticism of his team’s playing style

    Post  Tony P on Sat 26 Apr 2014, 6:43 pm

    If he stays - and that is the likely scenario - then he needs to have a mass clear out of the squad and replace the players with ones who DON'T fit his stereotype. Taylor, O'Brien, McCartney, Collison, Diarra, Diame, Demel, Joe Cole, Carlton Cole, Jarvis, Maiga, Jussi & Nolan are all either not good enough, disinterested or past their best. It would a big ask to get rid of them all and replace them so it probably won't happen. However, that is the reality of how poor our squad is right now
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    Re: Sam Allardyce chooses to ignore criticism of his team’s playing style

    Post  Campo on Sat 26 Apr 2014, 6:54 pm

    Our starting line up should have been more than enough to cope with todays game, 4 players up front cost £37M between them
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    Re: Sam Allardyce chooses to ignore criticism of his team’s playing style

    Post  Tony P on Sat 26 Apr 2014, 7:07 pm

    Campo wrote:Our starting line up should have been more than enough to cope with todays game, 4 players up front cost £37M between them

    But there is no pace in our midfield or up front. Our midfield is so slow it gets bypassed by any player with pace. When we do have possession we do everything at walking pace or with ponderous sideways passes. There is nobody busting a gut to support Carroll or to get into the box when crosses come in. Our set pieces are all the same; a chipped straight ball from Noble. Our defenders have one pass - HOOF ! Our full backs are so slow that they offer no width

    My point is - that whoever is up front there is nothing behind them to feed them quality passes or create chances for them

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    Re: Sam Allardyce chooses to ignore criticism of his team’s playing style

    Post  Campo on Sat 26 Apr 2014, 7:34 pm

    Agree Tony
    problem is had we been playing the scousers or Chelski then yes, we would get undone with speed from the oppo, this was West Brom, who are as cumbersome and slow as our lot
    Nolan apart from during Feb has been bloody AWOL which when he is the type of player he is , its just criminal for him to go missing for 90% of the season.

    I can not see the board putting up with this much longer

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    Re: Sam Allardyce chooses to ignore criticism of his team’s playing style

    Post  Jiggs on Sat 26 Apr 2014, 9:14 pm

    It's just so predictable to me.  I know I watch West Ham every week, but I can do the commentary before the commentators!  Then to actually attempt a carbon copy of our previous defeat ... words fail me!

    He's now on the offish, cap in hand it would seem after the way he usually responds to our supporters.. Talking about having to do more for the fans, of repeating the thrilling results against Tottenham, how it's stupid we've let ourselves get into this position, four games on the trot now, blah blah blah....You'll have to read the rest yourselves, it's making me feel sick. 

    As for you WHMonkey ........ trying to wind me up indeed  But if you want my tuppence'apenny worth on Sam Allerdyce, here goes ....

    He may not always start out with the hit and hope, or the long ball game. 
    He does have a plan B, but that is hit and hope, long ball....
    He has a bad attitude, which no doubt carries on into the dressing room. 
    His only tactics are mostly (a) ineffective (b) baffling.  
    He's so up his own arse, that he can't see beyond the Carroll/Nolan combination, or that Nolan is so bad at times he should be benched. Consequently he won't/can't give Nocerino a run in the first team. 
    He let Morrison go on loan to QPR (worst offence)


    That's all for now. Anybody .... feel free to add 


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    Re: Sam Allardyce chooses to ignore criticism of his team’s playing style

    Post  Tony P on Sun 27 Apr 2014, 12:01 am

    Campo wrote:Agree Tony
    problem is had we been playing the scousers or Chelski then yes, we would get undone with speed from the oppo, this was West Brom, who are as cumbersome and slow as our lot
    Nolan apart from during Feb has been bloody AWOL which when he is the type of player he is , its just criminal for him to go missing for 90% of the season.

    I can not see the board putting up with this much longer


    Not quite. Sessegnon strode through our cumbersome midfield for their goal. Berahino scared the shit out of our back four with his pace every time the ball went in behind them because our full backs are too old, slow and past it to cover around

    I agree about Nolan's "contribution". It must be pretty awesome off the pitch because on the pitch it is non-existent. It is clear to me that he is a luxury player who will get you a few goals. Well guess what Sam, so is Ravel Morrison. but he is 21 and quick, not 31 and slow. If we are not going to keep Morrison then go and get Ross McCormack who is perfect for that role behind Carroll - and he works his socks off too.

    As I have said in a previous thread our squad needs a major overhaul if we are to stay up next season
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    Re: Sam Allardyce chooses to ignore criticism of his team’s playing style

    Post  alfiehammer on Sun 27 Apr 2014, 9:46 am

    Admin wrote:I think now seriously , he needs to collect his P45 at the gates and piss awf . He done what he was brought here to do and he has done it . Needs a new manager to have a clear out , we have played better without Fat Sams dynamic duo of Carrol/Nolan so they could be 1 and 2 to follow their master .


    I really don't get all this Carroll bashing (no offence geezer, yours is just the first i see that i can make this point on)

    a year ago i was at the last game of the season with you and i would confidently say all 35,000 fans at the ground that day were singing 'andy carroll, we want you to stay'. All the posts over the summer were about hoping we would sign him permanently asap and worrying about liverpool keeping him or interest from other teams.

    to want thin out after one injury hit season seems a wee bit fickle to me.

    no offence mr geezer as i said, forums about opinions and yours is a popular tone based on FB etc. I think if we lost Andy he'd pop up elsewhere looking much more then a big lump of a target man and scoring goals. i think andys suffering along with all of us and it will probably cost him a world cup place (although mostly that will be down to his injury)

    IMHO
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    Re: Sam Allardyce chooses to ignore criticism of his team’s playing style

    Post  alfiehammer on Sun 27 Apr 2014, 9:46 am

    Admin wrote:I think now seriously , he needs to collect his P45 at the gates and piss awf . He done what he was brought here to do and he has done it . Needs a new manager to have a clear out , we have played better without Fat Sams dynamic duo of Carrol/Nolan so they could be 1 and 2 to follow their master .


    I really don't get all this Carroll bashing (no offence geezer, yours is just the first i see that i can make this point on)

    a year ago i was at the last game of the season with you and i would confidently say all 35,000 fans at the ground that day were singing 'andy carroll, we want you to stay'. All the posts over the summer were about hoping we would sign him permanently asap and worrying about liverpool keeping him or interest from other teams.

    to want thin out after one injury hit season seems a wee bit fickle to me.

    no offence mr geezer as i said, forums about opinions and yours is a popular tone based on FB etc. I think if we lost Andy he'd pop up elsewhere looking much more then a big lump of a target man and scoring goals. i think andys suffering along with all of us and it will probably cost him a world cup place (although mostly that will be down to his injury)

    IMHO
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    Re: Sam Allardyce chooses to ignore criticism of his team’s playing style

    Post  alfiehammer on Sun 27 Apr 2014, 9:55 am

    Jiggs wrote:
    SemiOldIron wrote:If we end up losing the last six games of the season, which looks likely, I just don't see how he can keep his job whether we stay up or not. How can the club sell season tickets on the promise of more of the same?
    The club are trying to sell season tickets with a bit of blackmail thrown in SOI ... They're absolutely shameless ......


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    shameless stuff indeed. i must admit, in two years time i hope to be a bit bette roof financially and able to get that ST then a new one in the OS.
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    Re: Sam Allardyce chooses to ignore criticism of his team’s playing style

    Post  Tony P on Sun 27 Apr 2014, 10:01 am

    I have no problem with Andy Carroll. I DO have a problem with playing Kevin Nolan just because a) Carroll is playing and b) he is club captain

    Andy Carroll thrives on crosses. Crosses - NOT long diagonal punts which are easy for defenders to see coming, and attack. To play to his strengths we have to be less predictable. We need to get the ball to our wingers QUICKLY. Our full backs need to be quick enough, fit enough and have the license/desire to get forward and get crosses into the box. AC wins his fair share of headers; after all it is why BFS bought him but our lumbering midfield are rarely in and around him to take advantage. If crosses are not working then we need a Plan B. We do NOT have one. We have no central midfield players with the guile, pace and forward passing ability to slide balls into his feet in key areas (well we do have Ravel Morrison but he has been discarded by BFS). Carroll is often isolated up front with at least two defenders on him and no support from midfield

    Carroll is a very good player who, with the right players around him and the right tactics, could be very good for us. Sadly nothing will change with this manager and this squad
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    Re: Sam Allardyce chooses to ignore criticism of his team’s playing style

    Post  alfiehammer on Sun 27 Apr 2014, 10:23 am

    i think it would be an epic mistake to lose carroll a this point. we'd probably lose a fortune on it too.

    My fave way to set up a football team is the little man big man two up front. Sunderland did it with quinn and phillips. England used to do it with heskey and owns (don't laugh)

    When its done properly it should give the opposing defenders the full spectrum of striking abilities to deal with- strength, ariel prowess and power from the big guy, a pacey, good finishing fox in the box from the little guy.

    I do like the old fashioned fast wingers that get balls into the box style of lay. man u with giggs, kanchelskis, sharpe, et all were very good at this in their day. and no one can accuse them of unattractive football.

    Maybe Ross McCormack is the one to make the big difference.
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    Re: Sam Allardyce chooses to ignore criticism of his team’s playing style

    Post  Campo on Sun 27 Apr 2014, 1:05 pm

    The biggest problem the Daves would have is who the hell to bring in if Sam was pushed

    To be honest I really have no clue who could turn this around that is within our grasp, who would want to come here?
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    Re: Sam Allardyce chooses to ignore criticism of his team’s playing style

    Post  Hungry Hammer 66 on Sun 27 Apr 2014, 1:30 pm

    Campo wrote:The biggest problem the Daves would have is who the hell to bring in if Sam was pushed

    To be honest I really have no clue who could turn this around that is within our grasp, who would want to come here?

    I'm hearin ya and completely agree but their decisions have got us here and like I said in my match day post
    "As a West Ham fan I don't have any expectations of success but like all fans we can still fantasise, hope and dream but it feels like even this is now being denied us"
    The whole situation feels like a catch 22 and were dammed if we do and dammed if we don't,
    Thanks Dave's, Thanks Brady, Thanks Fat Sham !!!
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    Re: Sam Allardyce chooses to ignore criticism of his team’s playing style

    Post  JulianDicksLeftKnee on Sun 27 Apr 2014, 2:11 pm

    Yes it's time to go, yes it's not nice football BUT it has secured us, done the job of getting us promoted from Chumps at first call, 10th last season, and probably safe this season.

    So agree with HH66's iroinic ending there. Thanks Dave's for securing the club after near bankruptcy, thanks Sam for getting us out of the Chumps and securing 2 seasons in the Prem (it's a money business after all)

    Time will tell what happens next and the wrong or right decisions are made-that is a normal footballing lottery.

    I won't relish the next season without Sam-mainly because I think the rebuilding of a squad and philosophy to suit fans (which lets face it, will never suit all fans) is a perilous business in the Prwm. It's not the place to experiment and get things right-the managerial casualty increase over the last 5 seasons show that.

    So, it's not been pretty but it's not been a disaster, as a business and achievement sense. Sam has done what was asked of him-in his way. Can't fault him and the board for that. Sorry its not the enjoyable West Ham way football, we all vainky believe we are entitled to-but it's done the job for the here and now-Look where we were 3 seasons ago under Grant and relegation-we weren't winning then-prettily or not. This club would have been fucked without the Dave's (or similar but it was the Dave's who did it) and potentially, after Grant, we would have been fucked as a club without instant promotion or 2 seasons secure.

    The football fan is a fickle thing. Last result means more than other achievements, a month ago we were unbeaten and everyone eased off the manager/board thing - as all club fans do.

    There is no magic recipe for success-money is a great help and we have a better chance of money now we have secured 3 seasons of success (financially if not in footballing entertainment) THIS was the most important thing-instead of a 55000 seater new stadium,, West Ham FC could have been extinct or playing in League 2 by now-to a dwiddling loyal fanbase of about 15000 with that figure only to shrink.

    This particular era of our history will never be looked upon fondly (except for the day at Wembley) but it is by far the most important era for the business of the club-and frankly there wouldn't be a club without business.
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    Re: Sam Allardyce chooses to ignore criticism of his team’s playing style

    Post  RichB on Sun 27 Apr 2014, 2:44 pm

    JulianDicksLeftKnee wrote:Yes it's time to go, yes it's not nice football BUT it has secured us, done the job of getting us promoted from Chumps at first call, 10th last season, and probably safe this season.

    So agree with HH66's iroinic ending there. Thanks Dave's for securing the club after near bankruptcy, thanks Sam for getting us out of the Chumps and securing 2 seasons in the Prem (it's a money business after all)

    Time will tell what happens next and the wrong or right decisions are made-that is a normal footballing lottery.

    I won't relish the next season without Sam-mainly because I think the rebuilding of a squad and philosophy to suit fans (which lets face it, will never suit all fans) is a perilous business in the Prwm. It's not the place to experiment and get things right-the managerial casualty increase over the last 5 seasons show that.

    So, it's not been pretty but it's not been a disaster, as a business and achievement sense. Sam has done what was asked of him-in his way. Can't fault him and the board for that. Sorry its not the enjoyable West Ham way football, we all vainky believe we are entitled to-but it's done the job for the here and now-Look where we were 3 seasons ago under Grant and relegation-we weren't winning then-prettily or not. This club would have been fucked without the Dave's (or similar but it was the Dave's who did it) and potentially, after Grant, we would have been fucked as a club without instant promotion or 2 seasons secure.

    The football fan is a fickle thing. Last result means more than other achievements, a month ago we were unbeaten and everyone eased off the manager/board thing - as all club fans do.

    There is no magic recipe for success-money is a great help and we have a better chance of money now we have secured 3 seasons of success (financially if not in footballing entertainment) THIS  was the most important thing-instead of a 55000 seater new stadium,, West Ham FC could have been extinct or playing in League 2 by now-to a dwiddling loyal fanbase of about 15000 with that figure only to shrink.

    This particular era of our history will never be looked upon fondly (except for the day at Wembley) but it is by far the most important era for the business of the club-and frankly there wouldn't be a club without business.
    So you agree he should be sacked JDLK?

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